Off The Road Vergaserkitt Instructions in English

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Off The Road Vergaserkitt Instructions in English

Postby dandywarhol » Thu Oct 22, 2015 6:47 am

I've translated the instructions for the OTR Tuning Kit for the 660 using Google Translate. This is the kit with the spacer for the diaphragm and the air nozzle you fit to the secondary carb slide.
I've changed some of the nonsensical translation into what I think makes better reading.
Alan

Installation instructions OTR Vergaserkitt MZ660

Thank you for purchasing our product. In order to avoid problems after installation , please follow installation instructions
observe and perform the conversion with care . During assembly, unless otherwise indicated , only all
Slightly tighten the screws and the assembly is complete with the prescribed by the vehicle manufacturer torque
Tighten . Periodically check the correct fitting of mounting parts and the screws are tight ! These
Growing instruction shall give only a general indication , it is knowledge , clean work and appropriate
Consideration ahead . We recommend the mounting uncertainties to be carried out in a specialist workshop .

Secondary gasifier (right carburettor)
1. Remove the airbox. Loosen the clamps on the intake of the carburetor. Remove the carburettors.
2. Remove the membrane with the control piston. The two screws of the needle cover
Loosen the control piston and the nozzle needle with all washers and spring. Press the clip on the needle out of the groove and into the second groove from the top
reinstate. Parts assembled to one side.
3. Expand with a 5mm drill the air hole at the bottom of the slide. Thoroughly clean the inside of the piston with brake cleaner or cleaning solvent. Fit the supplied stumbling tube to the inside of the control piston with silicone sealant Loctite or UHU-plus endfest (limited drying time!) 300
Insert. It has to the open side of the tube, the oblique side, in the direction of travel, ie towards the cylinder head
out show.
4. Then install the nozzle needle with all washers and spring in the piston, screw retaining plate. The piston
Carefully insert into the carburetor and put membrane into the groove of the lid. If the diaphragm too strong
be swollen, have to wait or fix the membrane with superglue you! Then the intermediate ring with the
Radius to the membrane toward hang up, use spring and replace the lid. Insert the screws from the Kit.
Insert the bolt rear left as the last screw, proceeding as in the expansion.
With intensive off-road use, it makes sense, the edge of the gasifier dome with housing, intermediate ring and lid of
externally sealed with silicone. Prior to sealing blow into the breather hose of the carburetor. There must be a "clunk"
be heard when the piston abuts in the lid! If only noise is heard, the membrane is not in the groove!
Open screws and assemble membrane again properly! Tighten clamps again to correct position of the carburetor with care !

Primary - carburetor (carburetor left)
1. Loosen the two screws of the carburettor cover and remove the cover.
Remove the screw on the shifter lever on the shaft of the carburetor actuation.
Remove the two screws of the slide. In from models
2000 must be raised to release the slide. The slide fog
Turn off upwards, take the nozzle needle out. The clip down
push into the fourth groove running from the top. Remount carburetor.
For tuned engines or using Racing - may mufflers a correction of the main nozzle of the constant pressure carburetor
be necessary (right). Given the lower brass hexagonal nut must be dismantled (14mm spanner size).
Then unscrew the main nozzle with angled screwdriver (slotted screw). Nozzle with the drills from the Kitt
Ream. For this purpose, the drill clamped in a chuck or a vice and the nozzle by hand in rotation
Ream. Start with the drill 170th The need arises from a lambda measurement or the candles picture.
For this purpose, a drive to two kilometers at full throttle, switch off the engine with the kill switch and control the candles picture. Of the
Insulator of candle should be light gray-brown to light-fawn. A dark gray border is able, depending on the current conditions . If the porcelain white , the engine is too lean .

Start the motorcycle and let the engine warm up. Adjust the idle speed now on a
the lowest possible level and look for the idle mixture screw (41) on the underside of the primary (left)
Carburetor. Has turn it slightly (!) Clockwise until the engine reaches the highest idle speed.
Possibly again with the stop screw (18) to readjust. From this point, the adjustment screw a quarter turn
turn fat into direction. If the speed increases slightly, the vote is correct.
If the engine runs at idle restless and it varies between sudden drop and subsequent rise, so is the
Idling system to rich set. Bring adjusting the Leerlaufregulierschraube (in 1/2 turn increments) in
Lean towards no improvement, it is to exchange useful the idling jet.
Does the speed after a short burst of gas well above idling speed fixed and decreases only after a delay to the
Idle speed of up to 1000 U / min back, so the idle system is set too lean.
Note: in practice usually leaky intake systems cause this error (eg a leaking intake manifold).

Before the first ride
Check
1) Double: vacuum lines, fuel lines, throttle cables, clamps, mounting bolts. Tubing and Cable guide or
any other parts that have been removed or altered during installation.
2) Turn the fuel tap to the "ON" position and check for leaks while filling the float chambers.
3} Start the engine, handlebars move from one stop to the other, that the throttle cables been correctly routed to ensure
are.
4) The throttle inputs high- twice briefly and turn back, to make sure the throttle linkage is not jammed
is safe and the slider moves freely. Also the membrane slide on free movement test!
5) Check the function of the engine kill switch (handlebar and side stand)!
Troubleshooting Guide
The correct settings for idling after installation of this nozzle set is required (installation instructions!)
After correct installation of your machine should Vergaserkitts flawlessly and with significant performance improvements
run. If your machine works well, but has no improvement in performance, try the needle positions
both sides of the initial setting in order to improve performance.
If your machine has more disturbances in function or performance, you work through this manual.
Make the SYMPTOMS find that matches your symptoms most likely to try and recommended the
solutions given. In some cases it may be that a number of proposals to fit your problem.
PROBLEMS STARTING AND IDLE
1. Bad cold behavior Start
IMPORTANT: The motorcycle should launch without a problem and run smoothly at idle without the carburetor is installed.
The following points please consider taking further steps.
Check whether the carburetor gets gasoline. Also check the choke system. Check the throttle position to the specifications
corresponds to that enough slack in the throttle cables and whether the slider running blockade. Check whether the float in the
Float chambers are set correctly. Also check for vacuum leaks. It is possible that tubes not
connected, brackets, etc. were not tightened (intake).
2. Bad behavior hot start
It is important to determine whether the motorcycle only difficult starts when you it has been a long time or if it always
bad start. Both states have usually to do with the settings too rich the engine. If you have trouble with it,
After the motorcycle has been a while, check for fuel tank vent problems or leaking float needle valves.
Check Furthermore:
Float chambers run over or incorrect float settings. Gemischeinstellschraube turned too far out .;
Carburettor synchronization is missing.
3. Engine Runs Rough idle until it reaches normal temperature.
Gemischregulierschrauben are set too lean.
4. Motor has good idle until it reaches normal operating temperature, then it runs irregularly, fluctuate or dies.
Gemischregulierschrauben are too fat. Also check whether the choke system over the
Sealing way. Real game in the gas and Chokekabeln?
5. Engine starts, not idling, black smoke coming from the exhaust and running very bold when revving.
Check for clogged idle nozzle.
Check for vacuum leaks or improperly attached hoses. Make sure that the float chamber vent hoses
be removed. Choke not fully closes; Fuel level too high in the float chamber. If all of these
Tests prove satisfactory conditions, build a the original needle. Then check again at idle. Does the vehicle
satisfactorily with the original needle, please notify us with the results. We then try to help you.
We that the idling of the engine does not get a lot of feedback from customers, the notice on the installation of a nozzle set,
is optimal and then they try to resolve the problem with changing the main nozzle. It is important, the difference
between the different load ranges to understand in the carburetors. The graph shows that the replacement of the main nozzles
to correct a problem at 3000 rpm has little or no influence on the mixture. So if you are a
Make carburetor adjustment, check with the help of the figure if this is useful for the envisaged speed range.

PROBLEMS WITH SLOW AND WHEN TRAVELING SPEED
6. A motor does not respond to throttle position on the idle addition.
6. B Motor accepts gas at idle, but not in first gear on.
6. C engine responds properly regarding symptoms A and B, but does not run smoothly at open throttle and constant speed.
6. D engine responds properly regarding symptoms A, B and C, but does not accelerate.
Check it. whether the main nozzles are completely drilled through and clean.
Check all distances and washers of the nozzle needles were assembled in the correct order.
Check that the slides move freely and that the rubber membranes seal properly and are not porous.
Check your bike to the type on the data sheet corresponds with respect. Year and model. If a racing air filter and / or a
Airbox cover is installed, the setting may be different!
If the above points have been checked and are satisfactory, attach the needle to an opening groove higher (ie fat).
With these symptoms it is not uncommon, the needle must also be hung to 2 channels or more higher.
Acceleration problems
The troubleshooting with respect to the acceleration curve is the most time consuming work. A good rule of thumb is: If you have a problem,
if you require more power, so your mixture is too rich. Do you have a problem, if you do not require more power, so is
Your mixture too lean. So before you begin to readjust your carburetor, check these two, the most frequently occurring
Problems. The stage 1 nozzle kit has been designed with a clean original filter element, not a retrofit filter.
Accessories filters often have a different passage as the original filter. Check that the intake corresponds to what the
Basic settings have been designed.
7. Motor accelerates up to the central region, has a hole, stutters or shut down until you close the throttle.
This problem tends to occur the higher the selected gear, check the basic setting according to your sheet. For
For the main nozzle of the stage 1 are used for the original airbox. The main jet of the mare 2 are only
K & N filter, open airbox cover and more open
Exhaust required. Check and make sure that the intake and exhaust flow to that described by us
matches. Check the correct installation of the parts delivered. Spacers under the needle, etc. as recommended by us and
are processed that your needles and main jets match and correctly.
If the above points have been checked and are satisfactory, set the needle a groove down to a small hole or
To resolve a stutter. Put the needle deeper and reduce the main jet to an even more pronounced problem
fix.
8. Motor accelerates up to the red zone, then flattens but from, increased between gear changes or even dies off.
The problem may be that the engine is running too rich or too lean. Set this at first as follows:
If the problem is more noticeable when the engine is cold, then you are dealing with a too lean mixture. Aggravated
the problem when the engine is warm, the mixture is too rich. Reduce the intake port on the airbox
stepwise with some tape. If the acceleration better, so you have a lean condition; it is even worse, so
the engine is running too rich. If one finds that the problem is too rich or too lean mixture, you simply change the
Main nozzles in the required direction. Required main jets you can mostly be obtained from us.
9. Motorcycle functions normally except that it shoots (bangs), if you take away the gas.
Check that there is no vacuum leaks. Check exhaust flange or tube seals have become leaky and
so that fresh air to enter the exhaust. If the above points have been checked and are satisfactory, set the
Mixture screw on a little richer (control idle!) A. On certain models with a secondary air system
Fresh air pumped into the exhaust. Check it. whether the problem lies herein by briefly supplying the air hose
disconnect . Also may be useful under some circumstances a larger idling jet.
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Re: Off The Road Vergaserkitt Instructions in English

Postby dandywarhol » Thu Oct 22, 2015 11:55 am

Here's some pics of the "stumbling tube" which fits into the piston on the secondary carb. Thanks to edfmaniac for his help describing the procedure.
The Kit comes with a 5mm drill to open up the piston to accept the stumbling tube. The block is 4.9mm diameter and the instructions state to silicon or glue the tube into the hole. I didn't like this way of "rattle fit" and relying on an adhesive so I drilled the hole 3/16" (4.76mm) and carefully filed out the hole to make the stumbling tube an interference fit in the piston. I also "belt and braces" it with a dab of Loctite Scotch Bond.

OTR Vergaserkitt MZ660 http://www.off-the-road.de/Diverse-Endu ... stiff.html

I'll let it cure overnight and fit it all back together tomorrow. Stay tuned for an update on the tarmac ripping performance update 8)

Stumbling tube

Image

Tube in the piston

Image

Tube in piston from underside

Image
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Re: Off The Road Vergaserkitt Instructions in English

Postby samandkimberly » Fri Oct 23, 2015 4:28 pm

If you look carefully at that "stumbling tube" you will realize that it is nothing more than a carefully filed 4.8mm pop rivet.
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Re: Off The Road Vergaserkitt Instructions in English

Postby dandywarhol » Sat Oct 24, 2015 3:55 pm

Not a pop rivet but might be a modified alloy rivet of sorts.
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Re: Off The Road Vergaserkitt Instructions in English

Postby samandkimberly » Sun Oct 25, 2015 9:12 pm

nope, its an aluminum pop rivet with the mandrel taken out: I've compared the two side by side. I'll be making one up in the next few weeks; I'll take a picture when I do.

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Re: Off The Road Vergaserkitt Instructions in English

Postby dandywarhol » Wed Oct 28, 2015 4:25 pm

Ok, I stand corrected :wink:

First impressions of the kit are favourable - stronger mid range when cracking open the throttle - less "lag". I've been trying various carb synch permutations, from the recommended 6mm of lift of the primary slide to virtually simultaneously - best seems to be around 3mm of lead but I'm having a problem getting the primary carb to run cleanly. It wants to run very rich whether on or off load. You can smell the unburnt fuel as it almost 8 strokes as the spark plug tries to burn the excess fuel :?
I've dropped the needle in stages but it is still rich - all the indications are that the pilot system is is letting too much fuel past and no amount of fine tuning with the mixture screw/needle gets it right. The richness starts when the primary slide is opened approx. 3 to 4 mm, giving a flat spot before the secondary carb chimes in. Whilst it's ok on the open road, it's a PITA in town. Any comments gratefully received
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Re: Off The Road Vergaserkitt Instructions in English

Postby Chuck in Indiana » Wed Oct 28, 2015 6:16 pm

dandywarhol wrote:Ok, I stand corrected :wink:

First impressions of the kit are favourable - stronger mid range when cracking open the throttle - less "lag". I've been trying various carb synch permutations, from the recommended 6mm of lift of the primary slide to virtually simultaneously - best seems to be around 3mm of lead but I'm having a problem getting the primary carb to run cleanly. It wants to run very rich whether on or off load. You can smell the unburnt fuel as it almost 8 strokes as the spark plug tries to burn the excess fuel :?
I've dropped the needle in stages but it is still rich - all the indications are that the pilot system is is letting too much fuel past and no amount of fine tuning with the mixture screw/needle gets it right. The richness starts when the primary slide is opened approx. 3 to 4 mm, giving a flat spot before the secondary carb chimes in. Whilst it's ok on the open road, it's a PITA in town. Any comments gratefully received


Well, I *assume* you've checked the float height.. and the needle and seat *are* seating. Next would be the enrichener..
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Re: Off The Road Vergaserkitt Instructions in English

Postby edfmaniac » Wed Oct 28, 2015 6:52 pm

dandywarhol wrote:Ok, I stand corrected :wink:

First impressions of the kit are favourable - stronger mid range when cracking open the throttle - less "lag". I've been trying various carb synch permutations, from the recommended 6mm of lift of the primary slide to virtually simultaneously - best seems to be around 3mm of lead but I'm having a problem getting the primary carb to run cleanly. It wants to run very rich whether on or off load. You can smell the unburnt fuel as it almost 8 strokes as the spark plug tries to burn the excess fuel :?
I've dropped the needle in stages but it is still rich - all the indications are that the pilot system is is letting too much fuel past and no amount of fine tuning with the mixture screw/needle gets it right. The richness starts when the primary slide is opened approx. 3 to 4 mm, giving a flat spot before the secondary carb chimes in. Whilst it's ok on the open road, it's a PITA in town. Any comments gratefully received


The pilot and air screw only effect idle. Any opening of the throttle at all brings the cutaway, main jet and needle setting into play. Are you running stock jetting? If so, it is too rich. Historically the pilot jet on these things is too lean so I'm fairly certain that isn't your problem. Try going down a jet at a time and dropping the needle. I was running 135/155 mains and making 56hp before switching to flat slide carbs. And I think you could go even leaner on a stock engine.
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Re: Off The Road Vergaserkitt Instructions in English

Postby dandywarhol » Thu Oct 29, 2015 6:41 am

Thanks Chuck and edfmaniac. It is/was my belief too that the pilot system would only affect idle/ throttle closed but the information sheet that came with the kit clearly shows a crossover of pilot as the slide is opened :? Mixture control and pilot jet influencing up to around 3000 rpm. Probably because the mixture screw is a fuel screw, not an air screw. The pilot jet feeding it is below the fuel level - unscrewing the mixture screw enrichens the idle mixture as it lets more fuel into the airstream. An air screw operates the opposite way as it is bleeding extra air into the idle circuit fuel stream.

The float height is within spec so I'm happy with that, as appears to be the enrichener - although it only seems to come into effect at full extent of it's travel - my Yamaha TRX enrichener has several stages :? I used the enrichener just to make sure I wasn't kidding myself whether it was running too weak or rich - the enrichener killed it immediately! I've had it out of it's housing and the plunger and seal is ok.

I think I'm going to have to fully strip the carbs and have a close examination of jet numbers/rubber seals etc. It was only when I was adjusting the primary carb needle that I noticed that the screw heads had been tampered with - probably by someone not using a JIS screwdriver to properly fit the Japanese crosshead screws. Maybe someone has been messing about with jets - where they got the jets for a Teikei carb is anyone's guess! :wink:
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Re: Off The Road Vergaserkitt Instructions in English

Postby edfmaniac » Thu Oct 29, 2015 11:04 am

Thanks for the correction. We in the States commonly substitute air screw for pilot screw or idle mixture adjustment just as a habit. Do check your jets. My carb was happy with the Mikuni VM28/486 #40 in the pilot circuit and the 135/155 Keihin jets in the mains. You can find Keihin jets at Jets R Us that will fit. The factory jets are almost impossible to find over here.
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Re: Off The Road Vergaserkitt Instructions in English

Postby dandywarhol » Fri Oct 30, 2015 11:54 am

Pulled the carbs apart today and found that there was a missing "O" ring on the needle jet. The SZR660 manual kindly PMed to me by Den shows the ring as "gasket nozzle" above the main jet in the primary carb - it wasn't there!

I dug out an o ring from my bumper box of o rings and reassembled the carbs. There also wasn't a "gasket" on the plug for the secondary carb main jet either but it didn't appear to need one as there was no fuel leakage from the plug - but I fitted a gasket anyway.

Another road test and it's still running like a pig on the primary carb, if anything, worse than before :evil: So the missing o ring solved nothing :cry: . Time to get back to basics and thought back to Chuck's comment about the enrichening valve, or cold start plunger. I removed the plunger again but examined it more carefully this time and found a slight nick and cracking in the rubber o ring around the plunger. Another rummage around the bumper box of o rings and reassembled the system again.

Road test again and it's a different animal! Even the choke plunger allows the revs to rise for warm up (10 deg C around here at the mo), something it didn't do before. There's the tiniest of flat spot just around 3000 rpm before the secondary carb chimes in - I set the synch lag at 4mm but the primary needle clip is still in stock 3rd notch position - the OTR Kit recommends it raised to the 4th notch down, richening it slightly.

Thanks to all for their input to my ramblings - there's been a collection of fuelling problems ranging from the previous owner putting the carb breather directly to the crankcase breather to alleged missing o rings. Can anyone confirm that there is an o ring on the needle jet in the secondary carb? It is shown on page 118 on the PDF manual for the SZR.

Thanks, Alan PS, I can feel another track day coming on before the snows appear :D
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Re: Off The Road Vergaserkitt Instructions in English

Postby dandywarhol » Fri Oct 30, 2015 1:40 pm

What I'd forgotten was that the purpose of this post was to evaluate the OTR carb mod kit. In essence, it is difficult to come to a conclusion after fitting the kit due to the other faults in the carbs but what has happened as a result of the repairs and the mods is an engine which pulls hard from around 3,000 rpm and gets into its stride at 4000 all the way, all too soon, to the red line. I'll try Edf's suggestion of smaller main jets - it's very difficult to carry out a plug chop on the SZR due to the frame wrapped round the engine. But, when using the old 2 stroke power jet test of slightly rolling off at full throttle, the engine still pulls as hard, indicating it could be a bit rich.
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Re: Off The Road Vergaserkitt Instructions in English

Postby edfmaniac » Fri Oct 30, 2015 3:29 pm

Here's an exploded view of the carbs if they are the same one's that come on the MZ660. It shows a gasket under the tube that the left side main jet screws into, but nothing on the CV carb that I can see. http://www.yamahapartshouse.com/oempart ... carburetor
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Re: Off The Road Vergaserkitt Instructions in English

Postby dandywarhol » Sat Oct 31, 2015 1:10 pm

What part # are you talking about Edf? The missing gasket/washer on the cv carb is #26, it seals the plug #29. The missing o ring on the slide carb is #3 which is on a groove on the nozzle main #37. Neither were there.

Thanks for the drawing :D

I raised the primary needle a groove to the standard 3rd groove, readjusted the fuel mixture screw and it's 99% there, flat spot/hunting @3000 virtually eliminated on the move. However when opening the throttle a few mm in neutral it's rich - I'll lean off the fuel screw a bit more - it is so susceptible to the tiniest tweak but I'm really happy with the set up so far. Time now to dig out the spare head and start cleaning its ports up.

http://www.yamahapartshouse.com/oemparts/a/yam/500436d5f8700209bc78c2f8/carburetor
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Re: Off The Road Vergaserkitt Instructions in English

Postby edfmaniac » Sat Oct 31, 2015 6:18 pm

I posted the exploded view so you could look for the part you were asking about, the needle jet o-ring. Not sure what exactly you were talking about so I thought I'd just post something that might help you.
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